Discrimination at ExcelAsia?

[council]

Thanks to iamawomantolove (http://www.pinoyexchange.com/forums/member.php?u=128926) for the heads up on this one.


NO NURSING GRADUATES PLEASE!



I came across an observation (or comment) posted by a user in a Filipino internet forum, mentioning, among others, that in a particular job search site, there was a company advertising for CSR (Customer Service Representative) positions. There was one catch though. One of their requirements: “No nursing graduates please!”

I had to verify the claim of the user so I went to take a look at the said job search site, and true enough, I found the advertisement of that company.

Here’s a screen capture (excerpt) of the said advertisement, wherein I highlighted some parts.



http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a44/pbasister/excelasia-1.png




A captured copy of the full advertisement can be found here.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a44/pbasister/excelasia-full.png

The direct link (if still available) is here (http://ph.jobstreet.com/jobs/2008/11/default/80/2022200.htm?fr=c).

The company said that one of its requirements was that the candidate should have completed high school, or a vocational course or a college degree in ANY FIELD. Then it contradicts itself a few lines later by saying “No nursing graduates please!”

Now that may not necessarily mean discrimination at work, but I certainly feel that it definitely it IS discrimination against a particular group of individuals.

Or are they referring to “nursing” as those who have graduated but currently have newborn babies they are taking care of and breastfeeding? I don’t think so.

And that would still be discrimination whatever way you look at it.

I checked the company's other ads for different positions and some of them had these phrases as part of their (or their client's) requirements:

* No nursing graduates please
* PREFERABLY NO NURSING BACKGROUND
* NURSING GRADS applicants will also be accommodated.

So, depending on the position you'd apply for, a nursing background could actually either be lucky enough to be tolerated or unfortunately directly shunned.

OK so I'll ask the question directly.

What's with the company's (non) preference for nursing graduates? It's come to a point that they actually (or practically) tell us directly that "Hey, don't bother applying. We don't want you." This may be true for other employers as well - not just in this case.

The company now on the center stage, right under the glare of the spotlight, is ExcelAsia Training and Development Inc. with its office in Makati City. It has its sights set on being the “biggest Human Resources Solutions company in Asia.” But with that kind of attitude, it may encounter some rough sailing.


http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a44/pbasister/excelasia-2.png



If a company prefers to hire people based on certain qualifications, I am not totally against that, since it is within their rights to do so. However, the blatant, open and direct refusal (or limited preference) to hire those who are graduates of a certain course does not speak well of the company and its values. It sends out the wrong signals to other employers as well.

What about the job search site where this advertisement was initially placed - could they be liable as well for discrimination or failure to protect the rights (and interests) of the general public?

I'm no nursing graduate. I'm not even from any allied medical field. But being in the Human Resources field, I still find it offensive (to say the least) that an advertisement like that is accepted (or tolerated) for posting in an internet job search site that has a wide-reaching audience.

Does the management of ExcelAsia know that perhaps some of their subordinates are actually damaging their company's reputation by (maybe unknowingly) discriminating against certain types of applicants. Or do these actions have their blessings?

What else can we do to curb these incidents and prevent them from rising in the future?



(more thoughts to follow)

[Ice Burn]

This is just one of the many companies that practice blatant discrimination here in the Philippines...

[council]

I got to talk to someone from Jobstreet Philippines.

And all they said was something to the effect that ExcelAsia has a lot of postings, and although Jobstreet checks out the ads made, I should call up excelasia instead.

Pontius Pilate?

[immortalscythe]

I think the reason why they are not hiring nursing grads is because as we all know, nursing is one of in demand course right now, most of the graduates doesnt have chance to be in nursing field and as a workaround on not being a bum, they are applying in call center. And as ExcelAsia doing a mass hiring, they are afraid of flooding a resumes of nursing grads.

just my two cents!

[Dacs]

Well then, what makes them less qualified for the post?

[council]

I think the reason why they are not hiring nursing grads is because as we all know, nursing is one of in demand course right now, most of the graduates doesnt have chance to be in nursing field and as a workaround on not being a bum, they are applying in call center. And as ExcelAsia doing a mass hiring, they are afraid of flooding a resumes of nursing grads.

just my two cents!

Then again, in other positions, they mention:

* PREFERABLY NO NURSING BACKGROUND
* NURSING GRADS applicants will also be accommodated.

Bottom line lang naman, kung ayaw nila ng particular graduates, eh di ibasura ang application or ilipat sa iba. Pero wag naman out-and-out na "no nursing graduates please!"

[immortalscythe]

^ well you have a point there. ang sakit nga naman if you're on the shoes of nursing grads and you want to work on call center tapos napinpoint pa na NO Nursing Grads Please!

[gb25]

so true. my friend wants to apply as a csr/csa, unfortunately she said, she isn't qualified.. and it's all because she's a nursing grad.

call center companies don't want to hire nursing grad for they have this notion that once these nursing grad applicants passed their board exam they will leave the company and pursue their career abroad instead.

[Dacs]

so true. my friend wants to apply as a csr/csa, unfortunately she said, she isn't qualified.. and it's all because she's a nursing grad.

call center companies don't want to hire nursing grad for they have this notion that once these nursing grad applicants passed their board exam they will leave the company and pursue their career abroad instead.
That doesn't make them less qualified for the work and I don't think non-nursing grads act the same at all.

When they're able to find a work in line with their degrees, they'll resign anyway.

[council]

Here's something more strongly worded.

"Absolutely no nursing graduates please"

What if I had all the skills they were looking for? The only bar to my successful application would be that I am/were a nursing graduates?

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a44/pbasister/excelasia-4.png

[gb25]

^ loolz. katawa yun ah

[gb25]

may bond ba yang call center call center na yan?

[akoaydikilala]

Hindi call center ang ExcelAsia head hunter lang sila...
Nirerefer lang nila sa mga call center ang mga aplikante nila.
Maraming call center ang tumatanggap ng nursing grad.

[council]

Here's a letter/comment from the ExcelAsia management sent to me. Below it is my reply.

ExcelAsia Management Says:
November 27, 2008 at 4:33 am

Dear Bloggers,

Greetings from ExcelAsia. I am from management and I would just like to inform everyone that first and foremost, we do accept nursing graduates, in fact we have a whole dedicated FREE training class just for them. The only reason some of our ads have that line is because some of the accounts we serve (call center requirements) do not accept nursing graduates because they are looking for financial or technical background. But when we opened our free training classes for nurses, some of our clients started accepting because we pushed for it and we are proud to say that as I write this letter, we have trained (for free), and placed nearly 50 nurses to date. :)They are all working in call centers now. The nursing industry is good for us and we would like to invite more nurses to apply with us.

I think the misunderstanding here lies in the fact that we have over 30 multinational clients and some clients accept nursing graduates, some don’t. And the reason we have that in our ads is because the account managers that handle specific accounts (for technical and financial) don’t want to waste your (nurses) time by coming all the way here just to find out that they need a financial or technical degree. We even have ads that say Nursing graduates welcome! :) We have specific requirements for specific accounts.

Nevertheless, our intent was never to insult or discriminate against any specific background or degree. Our goal is to provide jobs to people who need them and we are urging those nurses who are seeking great careers to come over and apply.

Thank you for bringing this up to us.

The Management.

Dear ExcelAsia Management,

Thank you for your email and comment.

While I agree that some clients prefer technical and financial skills, perhaps it would be better to put them as preferences rather than mention other courses as non-preferences.

Besides, the nurses won’t be wasting time going all the way there to your place if they submit their applications online - you won’t call them up if they’re not needed for a particular program or project.

And if they do go to your office, you can always refer them to another program or project within your company’s clients who are willing to accept nursing graduates.

So there isn’t any waste of time anywhere for them.

The only waste of time may actually be with your employees sifting through a lot of emails or applications and deleting those who are nursing graduates. Then again with Jobstreet, you can actually forward the resumes from one applied position (advertisement) to another one that you also have that accepts nursing graduates.

[bytes_girl]

the ads is so ridiculous and very contradicting

If Excel Asia means what they have said in their letter, they should have not done that the first place, or let say, if they are following a template in posting a certain ads for their client, they should review it before forwarding it to jobstreet, making sure that there are no clause or phrase from their ads that might imply something such as alienating people or group of people coming from different background.

If I am a nursing grad, and I know I am as qualified as the other who have came from different field, and I want this offer, I will definitely tag this as 'discrimination'.

If before we have this so-called 'pwede-pwede na' in all things, today is different, filipino people are beginning to be more observant, vigilant and aware of its environment, and 'small things' like this one, can lead to something bigger, so if its only a 'mistake' and if Excel Asia claims that they mean no harm, well... excuse me...they already did...

I hope Excel Asia knows what 'empathy' means, since they are offering Customer Service position... yun lang

[marilynmangubat]

actually lahat ng companies sa pinas, may discrimination. look at the ads and you will see may preference sila kung ano age mo dapat, babae lang or lalaki, may work experience dapat and many others. :(

[Dacs]

Mahirap naman kung walang basis yung pag hire, especially pagdating sa work experience.

Pero I have to admit, bihira pa lang dito ang equal opportunity employer

[CoolCucumber]

^Yeah, I agree. Nung nag-a-apply 'yung mga cousins-in-law ko na taga-FEU at UST, kuwento nila na 'yung HR pinakukuha na agad ang mga application ng mga taga UP, Ateneo at La Salle para unahin na sa interview.

Ang naging pinakaproblema na lang sa ExcelAsia ay masyadong blatant ang discrimination nila.


:rpflag:

[mackylee]

i want to thank COUNCIL for doing such a heroic thing for us nurses. THANK YOU!!! thanks for opening this up and for doing something about it .

[ubermensch]

yeah. thanks to council and iamawomantolove

Here's a letter/comment from the ExcelAsia management sent to me. Below it is my reply.

ExcelAsia Management Says:
November 27, 2008 at 4:33 am

Dear Bloggers,

Greetings from ExcelAsia. I am from management and I would just like to inform everyone that first and foremost, we do accept nursing graduates, in fact we have a whole dedicated FREE training class just for them. The only reason some of our ads have that line is because some of the accounts we serve (call center requirements) do not accept nursing graduates because they are looking for financial or technical background. But when we opened our free training classes for nurses, some of our clients started accepting because we pushed for it and we are proud to say that as I write this letter, we have trained (for free), and placed nearly 50 nurses to date. They are all working in call centers now. The nursing industry is good for us and we would like to invite more nurses to apply with us.

I think the misunderstanding here lies in the fact that we have over 30 multinational clients and some clients accept nursing graduates, some don’t. And the reason we have that in our ads is because the account managers that handle specific accounts (for technical and financial) don’t want to waste your (nurses) time by coming all the way here just to find out that they need a financial or technical degree. We even have ads that say Nursing graduates welcome! We have specific requirements for specific accounts.

Nevertheless, our intent was never to insult or discriminate against any specific background or degree. Our goal is to provide jobs to people who need them and we are urging those nurses who are seeking great careers to come over and apply.

Thank you for bringing this up to us.

The Management.




Whether or not they intended to discriminate, they ended up being discriminatory. They could just have specified they needed people with technical and financial backgrounds, and come up with a list of sample courses satisfying their requirements.

Even if their clients were the ones who made the request to have that line, they should have made a stand and said: "No, we can't put that since it's discriminatory. How about we do it this way?"

And if they didn't want to waste nurses' time because of their perceived lack of the necessary background, why bar only nurses? Why not journalism, literature, fine arts graduates too?

The ad was prejudiced against nurses without just cause. That's discrimination.

[yoroshikuonegai]

ganun din lahat ng kompanya though patago nilang ginagawa. Maaaring hindi nakalagay sa qualifications pero kapag nagaayos na sila ng resume hinihiwalay talaga nila mga resumes ng mga up ateneo and la salle from other schools.

Sa tingin ko mentality nila diyan iniisip nila "ahh malamang nagapply itong nursing grad na ito sa call center dahil hindi makahanap ng trabaho" ganun.

[slimrock]

hay naku, hindi lang yan ang nag-iisang ad na may discrimination...

[majanerz]

well maybe they've known about this forum, i am a nursing grad... Last Wednesday i had an interview at Excel Asia... I asked about the discrimination thing about nurses, but I have no idea that they had this discriminative ads, hehehe..:)

i was shocked when the interviewer became so defensive and discussed it with me for about 10 mins... hahaha... now I know! :rotflmao:

but luckily i got my first cc job ever with their help... hehe!:p

well.. in my opinion, it's not only us who leaves cc in a short time... andami kayang nag-cocall center hopping n nde nx grads??

diba?*okay*

[ron_pacman]

i think isang reason bakit ayaw nila nursing grads e dahil madaming nursing grads na nagcacallcenter muna habang inaayos pa ang papeles bago umalis ng bansa. di ko sinasabing tama yung paglagay nila ng no nursing grads sa ad nila...pero maaaring yan ang reason.

[pa3n]

Not all nursing grads leave after passing board exam. I am a nursing grad, my friends are nursing grad and we are all in the call center industry. With no plans of leaving just yet, wala rin naman opportunity sa nursing field as of now eh. :)

So thank you to those companies who entertained us without prejudice or discrimination. Those companies really are equal opportunity employers, to name a few, etelecare and sitel. But I have my fare share of rejection simply because of being a nursing graduate.

:)